America Is NUTS

[RE Virus]

Whoever is behind the "war on terror" is not so relevant to me. It's how we undo the mess that counts. It is not about finding/blaming a particular perpetrator, which is relatively easy.

So how exactly do we "undo the mess" without knowing who is causing the mess?

[crispncrunchy]

So how exactly do we "undo the mess" without knowing who is causing the mess?

RE,

I thought I gave a broad answer to that in the next sentence. To quote myself:

The hard part to crack is creating a global environment where these problems are irrelevant.

I think we both know that it is not just the Zionists that are behind the mess. The US, UK, Australia, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Taliban, Al-Qaeda etcetera are all complicit.

Basically my philosophy is that we need to forgive and get on with building societies (both in the West and the Middle East) where citizens can get on with their lives without fear.

I've got 2 examples of this from the 20th century.

1. The post Apartheid trials in South Africa setup by Nelson Mandela and the ANC where whites were not sentenced and forgiven as long as they admitted and disclosed their crimes. This allowed South Africa to get on with rebuilding their nation.

2. The Marshall Plan setup to rebuild Japan after the second world war, now Japan is a flourishing and responsible nation.

America's actions at the end of WW2 are highly admirable. What's happened since? Is it Globalism and the rise of corporate power? It's a topic worthy of discussion.

There is no easy solution to the mess, but I don't think fighting wars is the answer. Ask any WW2 veteran what they think of war, the vast majority will say don't do it.

Surely the solution must involve forgiving and rebuilding.

[doyle]

The Marshall Plan was to rebuild Europe and to stop communism, i'm pretty sure... nothing about Japan.. but nonetheless, Europe flourished.

[crispncrunchy]

Thx Doyle,

I got it wrong, mixing up my names General Douglas MacArthur applied much the same reforms in Japan after WW2.

As you point out the US reform policy worked in both Europe and Japan.

Can something like this happen today?

[doyle]

Not really crispy... I mean, the Marshall plan was put in place AFTER the fighting was over, to ensure that their political status was capitalist. We can throw as much money as we want in Iraq, the Civil war isn't going to stop.

Your solutions work great in a Globalist society. Like Europe, Japan etc. The Middle East is largely tribalist. You can't paint the whole world with the same paint brush. As a tribalist society worries only about their own society, and a globalist tries to strive for a greater good, apologies won't do anything, diplomacy has been tried since the creation of Israel itself. It would be better for the middle east just to "disappear from the pages of time". Just kidding.

[RE Virus]

The hard part to crack is creating a global environment where these problems are irrelevant.

That's rather the impossible part...

I think we both know that it is not just the Zionists that are behind the mess. The US, UK, Australia, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Taliban, Al-Qaeda etcetera are all complicit.

Name one bad thing Saudi Arabia, Iran, Taliban, or "Al-Qaeda" have done that has affected the world on a global scale.

The truth is that al-Qaeda doesn't exist as a real organization. It's more of a "spirit" or ideology. Osama is dead, Zawahiri is a fraud, as is Adam Gadahn/Pearlman, and so was al-Zarqawi. The Taliban were/are religious fanatics, but they never did anything of consequence other than cutting off 90% of the world's opium trade.

Basically my philosophy is that we need to forgive and get on with building societies (both in the West and the Middle East) where citizens can get on with their lives without fear.

You have an unreasonably optimistic view. You don't know the evil behind the mess.

I've got 2 examples of this from the 20th century.

1. The post Apartheid trials in South Africa setup by Nelson Mandela and the ANC where whites were not sentenced and forgiven as long as they admitted and disclosed their crimes. This allowed South Africa to get on with rebuilding their nation.

2. The Marshall Plan setup to rebuild Japan after the second world war, now Japan is a flourishing and responsible nation.

Yeah, that's all great. So what do you propose for the current situation?

America's actions at the end of WW2 are highly admirable.

Are you trying to be sarcastic? Dropping atomic bombs on Hiroshima & Nagasaki for no reason other than killing innocent Japanese is admirable? The brutal occupation of Korea was admirable? Starving over a million Germans in Eisenhower's death camp is admirable?

There is no easy solution to the mess, but I don't think fighting wars is the answer. Ask any WW2 veteran what they think of war, the vast majority will say don't do it.

Surely the solution must involve forgiving and rebuilding.

You make the fatally flawed assumption that the people in power want peace.

You said you agreed that Israel was behind 9/11, didn't you? Obviously they did it to start wars. So what would make you think they want to give it up? I'm not quite following your logic here.

The Marshall Plan was to rebuild Europe and to stop communism, i'm pretty sure... nothing about Japan.. but nonetheless, Europe flourished.

Except Germany. Millions of Germans died because of Allied policy.

[doyle]

Yeah, perhaps Russia starved ze East Germans, but I'm pretty sure West Germany flourished... The Marshall plan had very little to do with World War 2, but with fighting Communism.

[RE Virus]

Yeah, perhaps Russia starved ze East Germans, but I'm pretty sure West Germany flourished... The Marshall plan had very little to do with World War 2, but with fighting Communism.

The only thing that flourished was poverty, misery, and death. It took Germany a few decades to start recovering. I'm not sure who had the worst quality of life - the West Germans or the East Germans under Stalin.

[crispncrunchy]

Name one bad thing Saudi Arabia, Iran, Taliban, or "Al-Qaeda" have done that has affected the world on a global scale.

Saudia-Arabia - 73 oil crisis, support of GB junior's failed oil companies & financial backing of Halliburton
Iran - 1979 kidnapping of US embassy staff, its current uranium enrichment progem

The truth is that al-Qaeda doesn't exist as a real organization.

Can't agree with that, Zionism and Fascism are both real organizations and they each have an ideology and "spirit".

You have an unreasonably optimistic view. You don't know the evil behind the mess.

Mate, I'm not optimistic, this situation is a mess; witchhunts & blame don't solve the problem. The cliché "History Repeats" is an a testament to that fact. I think there has to be another way and that is altruism. It's hard and not tried very often, but when it is there are results. Recrimination only inflames the problem.

Are you trying to be sarcastic?

No, I said at the end (in the aftermath) not during or toward the end. Compare it to the aftermath of WW1 and the draconian Versailles Treaty - the consequence of which was Hitler and his Nazis, which was a far far far more brutal regime that anything you've brought up.

Starving over a million Germans in Eisenhower's death camp is admirable?

You are quoting a widely discredited opinion/book by James Bacque http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eisenhower_and_German_POWs. Starving Germans was yet another messy situation and ugly mistakes were made by the Allies along with masses of good work. However, what you are raising pales into insignificance compared to the Nazi party's activities.

I have to add that I have a very good 87 year old Hungarian friend (a Doctor in the Hungarian Army during WW2) who was in refugee camps for 3 years at the end of the war. He was lucky in that he worked with the Americans soldiers in the camps as a medical officer and they protected (harbored) him from repatriation by the Soviets. He saw, first hand, the Eastern European's joy at the end of the war change to outright fear of the Soviets. America has changed since then.

Just a footnote about the webpage you refer to... it says the following "Did you know that in Eisenhower's military school yearbook he was described as "the terrible Swedish-Jew"?". Ha, Eisenhower was NOT a Jew! Both his parents (& especially his mother) were Jehovah's Witnesses. The Eisenhower family arrived from Germany (via Switzerland) in 1741, they were Mennonites - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mennonites

You make the fatally flawed assumption that the people in power want peace.

Where did I say/assume that? Personally I would like to see peace but the human psyche makes that extremely difficult.

There is no denying that POWER CORRUPTS!

You said you agreed that Israel was behind 9/11, didn't you?

I see that my previous post could lead you this conclusion, but that was not what I was ambiguously stating. I agree that many of the "official facts" of 9/11 (both in NYC and particularly the Pentagon "strike") don't add up. As for your blaming of Israel/Zionists, I'm can't discount the American regime's involvement in these conspiracies. The Zionists are definitely a significant factor but there are other just as important factors such as America wanting to secure and protect their oil interests.

Millions of Germans died because of Allied policy.

Million's more died because of Nazi and Soviet policy.

Finally this war on terror, oil imperialism will fade away. Why?
1. We are going to run out of CHEAP oil within a few decades. Peak oil production is only 5 years away.
2. Global Warming is a much much bigger problem, we need to drop oil, it's not clean. Neither is coal and Australia has at least 700 years of global supply (in the ground still). If we don't take action on this problem now, there won't be much of global economy to speak of, it will become dog-eat-dog ala Dark Ages. If America (& Australia's) tawdriness continues then it's bye-bye to Super-power status within a 100 years.

RE, I don't know exactly where we are going with all of this, but I will say that it taking up valuable SSX play time. So I'm going back to shave a few more seconds off my Happiness time, master a few Wormholes, then look at all your OT Master Runs (again) and post a few times there.

Crispy

[RE Virus]

Name one bad thing Saudi Arabia, Iran, Taliban, or "Al-Qaeda" have done that has affected the world on a global scale.

Saudia-Arabia - 73 oil crisis, support of GB junior's failed oil companies & financial backing of Halliburton

The 1973 oil crisis was not caused directly by Saudi Arabia, but by the Yom Kippur War, which was caused by Israel's land grab in the Six-Day War in 1967. How does Halliburton or Arbusto have a significant effect on the world? Who cares if Bush, Cheney and a few others fill their pockets? Unless you believe Bush & Cheney are the brains behind the war against the Middle East, of course.

Iran - 1979 kidnapping of US embassy staff

Okay, that's one that had a significant effect, and it's probably the only one. But whose fault was it, really? The Iranians were pissed off at the Americans for messing with their country. The US and Israel virtually controlled their government. Have you heard of Operation Ajax, when they overthrew the Prime Minister?

Today the Iranians are being threatened by the criminal warmongering Zionist Israel, Zionist USA, and Zionist Britain with nuclear war. Some Brits were spying on them, but they pardoned them in just 14 days and sent them back without conditions. Not quite what you can say of the US...

How Iran treats prisoners:



How the US treats prisoners:

The truth is that al-Qaeda doesn't exist as a real organization.

Can't agree with that, Zionism and Fascism are both real organizations and they each have an ideology and "spirit".

Zionism and fascism are not organizations by themselves... Zionism is an ideology that has countless organizations (which are composed of REAL people, something you seem to not understand) supporting it, and fascism is an ideology with currently little support, despite being much more honorable than Zionism. Zionism survives only because of extreme deception. "Al Qaeda", on the other hand, has no real organized structure. We are told Osama and al-Zawahiri are the leaders of this well-structured, international, and powerful organization. This is total bull, as is easily demonstrable.

Mate, I'm not optimistic, this situation is a mess; witchhunts & blame don't solve the problem. The cliché "History Repeats" is an a testament to that fact. I think there has to be another way and that is altruism.

That would only work in a perfect world. Do you think any of the people we just mentioned are altruists? Is that why they destroyed Afghanistan and Iraq and are threatening Iran?

Are you trying to be sarcastic?

No, I said at the end (in the aftermath) not during or toward the end. Compare it to the aftermath of WW1 and the draconian Versailles Treaty - the consequence of which was Hitler and his Nazis, which was a far far far more brutal regime that anything you've brought up.

Who was behind the Versailles Treaty? Is there anything more to the Nazis than the history books tell us? Who writes the history books? Have you heard of the Transfer Agreement, for example? Have you heard of Max Warburg, Jacob Schiff, or Prescott Bush? How about Solomon Mayer Rothschild or Maria Anna Schickelgruber?

Starving over a million Germans in Eisenhower's death camp is admirable?

You are quoting a widely discredited opinion/book by James Bacque

Widely discredited by whom? By Wikipedia? You have to realize that Wikipedia is mainstream media. The rules of Wikipedia, hidden between lots of rubbish as they are, clearly state that Wikipedia does NOT provide the truth about anything, but only mainstream media and official deceptions. I can explain this in detail if you want. That said, Bacque is not the only source of this. He put a book together about it, that's all.

Starving Germans was yet another messy situation and ugly mistakes were made by the Allies along with masses of good work. However, what you are raising pales into insignificance compared to the Nazi party's activities.

Even if you believe that millions of people were killed with bug spray, millions of innocent Germans also died during AND after the war. It is comparable by numbers. Also, do you know how many people died in Soviet Gulags?

Just a footnote about the webpage you refer to... it says the following "Did you know that in Eisenhower's military school yearbook he was described as "the terrible Swedish-Jew"?". Ha, Eisenhower was NOT a Jew! Both his parents (& especially his mother) were Jehovah's Witnesses. The Eisenhower family arrived from Germany (via Switzerland) in 1741, they were Mennonites - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mennonites

OR, that's what he pretended to be. Why did the school yearbook say this? Did someone just make it up? I don't know if he was a crypto-Jew or not, but looking at his actions and at the other WW2 leaders, he likely was. Again, does it really matter? It's not like he was the real brain behind the war effort anyway.

There is no denying that POWER CORRUPTS!

Furthermore, only corrupt people seek power over others. Which means that the people in power are rarely good people, especially over time.

You said you agreed that Israel was behind 9/11, didn't you?

I see that my previous post could lead you this conclusion, but that was not what I was ambiguously stating. I agree that many of the "official facts" of 9/11 (both in NYC and particularly the Pentagon "strike") don't add up. As for your blaming of Israel/Zionists, I'm can't discount the American regime's involvement in these conspiracies. The Zionists are definitely a significant factor but there are other just as important factors such as America wanting to secure and protect their oil interests.

Nobody is saying that "the American regime" wasn't involved in 9/11. (Well, actually, some fools are, like Doyle and gondee.) We're talking about the actual execution of the attack -- you can't find any evidence of non-Jews being directly involved, with the notable exceptions of Dick Cheney and Rudy Giuliani. And again you have to ask yourself, who is "the American regime"?

You need to look deeper into 9/11 and find out who (the NAMES, not the corporations) is behind it. Then you will understand what the wars are for.

Millions of Germans died because of Allied policy.

Million's more died because of Nazi and Soviet policy.

Of course -- who is saying otherwise? We were talking about "America's admirable actions after WW2" here.

Finally this war on terror, oil imperialism will fade away. Why?
1. We are going to run out of CHEAP oil within a few decades. Peak oil production is only 5 years away.

How do you know that? 5 years ago you probably said the same thing.

2. Global Warming is a much much bigger problem, we need to drop oil, it's not clean. Neither is coal and Australia has at least 700 years of global supply (in the ground still). If we don't take action on this problem now, there won't be much of global economy to speak of, it will become dog-eat-dog ala Dark Ages. If America (& Australia's) tawdriness continues then it's bye-bye to Super-power status within a 100 years.

Have you done any research on Global Warming? I'm convinced it's a scam. The man-made idea, that is. I'll make a thread about this.

RE, I don't know exactly where you are going with all of this, but I will say that it taking up valuable SSX play time. So I'm going back to shave a few more seconds off my Happiness time, master a few Wormholes, then look at all your OT Master Runs (again) and post a few times there. Crispy

So playing SSX is more important than what is happening to the world? You should investigate 9/11 instead. It can be more fun, even!

[DJD]

RE, I don't know exactly where you are going with all of this, but I will say that it taking up valuable SSX play time. So I'm going back to shave a few more seconds off my Happiness time, master a few Wormholes, then look at all your OT Master Runs (again) and post a few times there. Crispy

So playing SSX is more important than what is happening to the world? You should investigate 9/11 instead. It can be more fun, even![/quote]

Not to be pestilent, RE, but what do you propose that we do about what is happening to the world? What will you do with all of your knowledge of current events? Are you a member of a secret organization who will work against the powers that be? While research and fact-finding are admirable pursuits, does any alternative-conspiracy-theorist (you didn't give me an alternative for the term "conspiracy theorist") actually do anything other than placiing blame?

The world sucks. People suck. Still, life can be good, and SSX is always good.

[crispncrunchy]

Thx for asking that question DJD.

RE - Do you have any solution to the "War on Terror" mess?

I would like to see what you have to say about Global Warming. I await your thread.

[RE Virus]

RE, I don't know exactly where you are going with all of this, but I will say that it taking up valuable SSX play time. So I'm going back to shave a few more seconds off my Happiness time, master a few Wormholes, then look at all your OT Master Runs (again) and post a few times there. Crispy

So playing SSX is more important than what is happening to the world? You should investigate 9/11 instead. It can be more fun, even!

Not to be pestilent, RE, but what do you propose that we do about what is happening to the world? What will you do with all of your knowledge of current events? Are you a member of a secret organization who will work against the powers that be? While research and fact-finding are admirable pursuits, does any alternative-conspiracy-theorist (you didn't give me an alternative for the term "conspiracy theorist") actually do anything other than placiing blame?

It should be as easy as arresting the criminals. We need more people to care, and we need to educate the police. If the Muslim nations wised up and united, the Zionists would fail in no time. We need to keep spreading the information. Someone with lots of money and resources could do a lot of good, like Jimmy Walter did back in 2004-2005. But he wasn't wise enough, so he was sabotaged by false friends and ruined. So why don't you join the truth movement and help the world? If you have any revolutionary solutions we'd be glad to hear them.

Some alternatives to the misused and derogatory term "conspiracy theorist" are: researcher, investigator, truth seeker, truther, ...

[NA]

How Iran treats prisoners:



How the US treats prisoners:

Just picked this up, RE do you read English papers? The girl sold her story for quite a large sum, among many things they stripped her and teased her. That was a bad example of Iran verses America, that cannot be proved by two well chosen pictures on your behalf. Because there was a huge uproar about how she shouldn't be selling tales of her suffering for money. So I disagree with what you said about the pictures.

[RE Virus]

Well, that boils down to who you'd rather believe: the Zionist UK government, or the Iranian government. Which government has lied its people into wars? Which government is trying to get its people into another war with -- guess whom -- Iran?

What was the first thing the UK government did when the spies returned? Use them as propaganda against Iran. The UK government has zero credibility. Everything they say should be regarded as a lie. Or how many times does someone have to lie to you before you suspect everything they say?

Also, why would they treat them like that? Muslims don't usually treat people like that. And even if they did, it's not comparable to Abu Ghraib. Torture, rape, humiliation, etc, is far worse than "stripping and teasing".

[NA]

Well, that boils down to who you'd rather believe: the Zionist UK government, or the Iranian government. Which government has lied its people into wars? Which government is trying to get its people into another war with -- guess whom -- Iran?

What was the first thing the UK government did when the spies returned? Use them as propaganda against Iran. The UK government has zero credibility. Everything they say should be regarded as a lie. Or how many times does someone have to lie to you before you suspect everything they say?

Also, why would they treat them like that? Muslims don't usually treat people like that. And even if they did, it's not comparable to Abu Ghraib. Torture, rape, humiliation, etc, is far worse than "stripping and teasing".

Well I'll be honest, reading the papers today (but they're probably run by jews) And being honest again it was the Daily mail which is the most bias fuckin paper against immigrants in England, they showed two lots of images. One was of some of the boys watching football and playing table tennis. This is of those kidnapped in Iran. But then next too that you had that Faye Turner and another guy telling their stories of how they were tortured and stuffs, one was blind folded mocked.

Then next to it they had a load of peoples thoughts on the whole selling of stories, most people thought it was bollox to be fair. A mother of a girl recently killed by a car bopmber was sobbing and all You shouldnt sell stories for line of duty etc.

Dunno what you'd make out of that, but personally I think it's all a bit out of order.

On another note: Humiliation worse than stripping and teasing? Dunno bout you but I'd class being stripped naked in front of a load of people to be humiliating but whatever.

[RE Virus]

You don't "kidnap" soldiers, you capture them. See the subtle yet important semantic difference? Only civilians are kidnapped. The use of the word "kidnap" is propaganda. They were captured in Iranian waters, according to Iran. Which government has the most credibility, again? And how many times does someone have to lie to you, again?

And have you heard of the captured and kidnapped Iranians? From my other thread:

It seems the Iranians stalled the Zionist Axis' plans a little by releasing the 15 British spies without conditions. They released them despite the incredible double standard of the 5 Iranian officials captured by the US military on January 11, the kidnapping of former Iranian deputy defense minister Ali Reza Asgari, and the kidnapping and torture of a (now freed) Iranian diplomat. Of course, you likely didn't know this if your only source of information is Fox News, CNN, BBC, or the New York Times. Predictably, the British government are now using the spies to create more anti-Iran propaganda.

[Sajjetta]

You don't "kidnap" soldiers, you capture them. See the subtle yet important semantic difference? Only civilians are kidnapped. The use of the word "kidnap" is propaganda. They were captured in Iranian waters, according to Iran. Which government has the most credibility, again? And how many times does someone have to lie to you, again?

Surely it can only be capture if you are at war with them????

[RE Virus]

If at war or if caught in malicious activities or sneaky behavior, such as spying.

Iran (and the entire world) knows that Israel and the US and UK governments are trying to create a war with them, and will use every dirty trick in the book.

[doyle]

It's almost like you want a war in Iran to happen.

[RE Virus]

It's almost like you want a war in Iran to happen.

Of course I don't, but those in power do, and it's inevitable. You don't put all that hardware in the Persian Gulf if you're not getting ready to attack.

You're obviously just one of those morons you will believe the media when they tell you Iran has nuked a US city. I'm tired of trying to reason with you. I've shown you undeniable proof that 9/11 was a false flag operation, but you continue pretending nothing is wrong. GTFO of my topics and watch TV.

[PD~]

I don't trust Iran for a second. They have this false front sense about them... they act innocent and don't want to start any trouble and are letting captured troops go and blah, blah. I almost can't wait for us to pull our troops out of Iraq, cuz that's when the real shit will hit the fan and people will see quickly why that'll be the fatal mistake of the Middle East.

Of course, I don't think we actually will pull our troops out despite all that's being said, and let's pray it stays that way.

[RE Virus]

I don't trust Britain for a second. They have this false front sense about them... they act innocent and don't want to start any trouble and are letting captured troops go and blah, blah. I almost can't wait for us to pull our troops out of Poland, cuz that's when the real shit will hit the fan and people will see quickly why that'll be the fatal mistake of Europe.

Of course, I don't think we actually will pull our troops out despite all that's being said, and let's pray it stays that way.

There is no difference, PD~, I'm sorry to tell you. He would never have admitted it either.

[crispncrunchy]

RE, You're quite witty as well as irascible.

I've been away up the country for a while so I'm picking up the thread...

Everything they say should be regarded as a lie. Or how many times does someone have to lie to you before you suspect everything they say?

Politicians (doesn't matter which type) don't always have to lie, however they should be treated with deep suspicion. The fun part is working out whether they are lying or not.

You don't "kidnap" soldiers, you capture them. See the subtle yet important semantic difference? Only civilians are kidnapped. The use of the word "kidnap" is propaganda. They were captured in Iranian waters, according to Iran. Which government has the most credibility, again? And how many times does someone have to lie to you, again?

Surely it can only be capture if you are at war with them????

Guys I've always seen capture more related to legality... you capture a criminal on the run, or an illegal immigrant, or a soldier who's crossed someone else's border without prior consent.

Conversely, a person who is kidnapped is taken illegally, so if some soldiers went into another country without consent and rounded up bunch of soldiers and took them back to their country that would be an act of kidnap.

So soldiers can be kidnapped. That said... with the borders at northern end of the Persian Gulf you need to watch your GPS closely to know whether you are in Iraq, Iran or Kuwait. I reckon the Poms strayed and thus RE is correct. They got captured!

And the British government has been trying to generate propaganda on the back of it. Same can be said of the Iranians, but the Poms were stupid to get themselves in such a mess.

You don't put all that hardware in the Persian Gulf if you're not getting ready to attack.

Lots of US Military Hardware has been floating around the Persian Gulf for over 60 years.

Anyway I will read your Iran thread and pick you up there

I don't trust Iran for a second. They have this false front sense about them... they act innocent and don't want to start any trouble and are letting captured troops go and blah, blah. I almost can't wait for us to pull our troops out of Iraq, cuz that's when the real shit will hit the fan and people will see quickly why that'll be the fatal mistake of the Middle East.

Of course, I don't think we actually will pull our troops out despite all that's being said, and let's pray it stays that way.

Dunno what you're thinking... If the US pull out of Iraq...
Iran will move into the south, like they've always wanted to.
Syria will go for the northern Karkuk oil fields, since their oil fields have been in decline recently and in a deal with Iran they will be able to get the Iraq-Syria-Lebanon Strategic Pipeline working again.
Turkey will massacre lots of Kurds (poor buggers always getting bashed up) and
Saudi Arabia are going to get pissed off with all the competition from the Iran-Syria Bloc.

So the US ain't going anywhere yet 'cause they will lose control of the oil. That's why the coalition of the willing went there in the first place, wasn't it?

[PD~]

I said I don't think we'll pull out, you said we aren't going anywhere... sounds like we feel the same way.

And no, for probably the 1,000th time I'll write this: We didn't go to war for the oil. Had we gone to oil and took over its control, we wouldn't be paying record high prices for barrels.